tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4589517995412770159.post295398243784669624..comments2022-12-13T03:26:16.267-05:00Comments on The Adventures of Maël & Cindy: Hierarchy in the Body of Christ - another small excursusMaëlhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14413309286655265584noreply@blogger.comBlogger3125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4589517995412770159.post-21229991034931183872010-06-18T21:12:03.805-05:002010-06-18T21:12:03.805-05:00My use for the words itinerant mainly comes from A...My use for the words itinerant mainly comes from Acts 11:27-28 for "some prophets." Philip the evangelist similarly (Acts 21:8). Those who were sent out, those with apostolic gifting, to plant churches seemed to be constantly on the move, whether like Paul for a couple weeks to a few years, encouraging the churches, not just the 11 and Paul but those whom Paul listed in his letters. I think we put the term "apostle" in a box, think mainly because of the abuses in church history when the word is used. (just like many other terms in the Bible) Church planting, is apostolic in nature, setting a foundation of Jesus Christ with new communities of Christ. I think more often than naught missionaries are mostly considered assistants to pastors of local churches when the New Testament does not indicate this approach. Church planters formed communities of Christ, churches who functioned under the Headship of Christ, then committed "to God and to the word of his grace." The church planter with their assistants then moved on as the Lord guided. Frank Viola's excellent work "Finding Organic Church" is really helpful! Hope this helps. God bless you brother!John S Wilson IIIhttp://johnswilson3.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4589517995412770159.post-34227725781786780072010-06-18T00:29:55.629-05:002010-06-18T00:29:55.629-05:00John:
Thanks for the continued interaction and e...John: <br /><br />Thanks for the continued interaction and encouragement. I have some thoughts/questions about your comment. <br /><br />I'm not sure Paul really thought that apostles were "the scum of the earth," but I do agree that throughout the book he tries to turn things upside down for the Corinthians.<br /><br />I think that equating apostles to our modern understating of church planters, while there might be some parallels, is a little anachronistic. In addition when talking of apostles, I think we need to be careful to differentiate the 3 uses of the term <i>apostolos</i>: the spiritual gift, the special position of the Twelve, or the missionary-like/messenger role of some in the NT, because they can be distinct. I think in 1 Cor 12, Paul is referring to spiritual gifts, not positions or roles.<br /><br />Can you show me where you get that prophets were generally itinerant?<br /><br />Thanks brother.<br /><br />Mae:lMaëlhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14413309286655265584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-4589517995412770159.post-12554266302395007662010-06-17T13:18:17.707-05:002010-06-17T13:18:17.707-05:00nice work Mael! I tend to think that Paul uses the...nice work Mael! I tend to think that Paul uses the list that he does to turn upside down the Corinthian's misplacement over use of tongues to the detriment of the body of Christ, given the context. Apostles according to Paul were generally the scum of the earth, so having it as "firstly" may be his reason for doing the list the way he did. Additionally, it is not a comprehensive list so it seems to imply that he is just trying to have the Corinthians rethink their opinions about the supposed importance of some gifts over others versus making a form of church hierarchy. All members have a function(s) in the church to help it stay on course in following Jesus' lordship, apostles or church planters being key in building that foundation. (The importance for 1/2 Timothy and Titus who were church planters). The rest of the gifts are part of God's building materials to strengthen it and build it into the fullness of His Son. I have found in face-to-face community with other believers and having Jesus as Lord and Head over that group, the working out and the building up of the body with the gifts given to it is probably the greatest way a church body truly grows and builds itself up in love. Apostles and prophets from what I've seen in scripture were generally itinerant while those more mature in each church, in living by Christ's life, helped guide the body to stay on course with Jesus as Head. I think church has tended to make a hierarchy in the body (using these few verses) to overly protect the body to the detriment of the function of the body.John S Wilson IIIhttp://johnswilson3.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.com